I received an email saying that the change is coming. I've been hearing for a while that 410A refrigerant will be phased out eventually. And now they have decided on which refrigerant will be the industry standard for all HVAC manufacturers.
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Hey guys before we get to today's video, please click that subscribe button, hey guys, joshua griffin, air, serving the middle peninsula in the northern neck of virginia and want to do a video, because i might be a little uh early. In fact, if you may see this video in the future, i i don't know how accurate all this information will be, but i uh i'm getting uh messages, i'm getting some wind about some changes in the hvac industry. If you go back about 15 well, probably 20 years ago, now they were doing away with the r22 refrigerant and they were coming out with the r410a refrigerant. It was more higher pressures and supposed to be better for the environment better for the ozone all this stuff and they actually made that shift.
So they phased it out. Um. You know slowly at first you, you know, prices went up and then uh eventually you know they stopped making the equipment, but you could well they. They stopped charging the equipment, but you could still buy it dry, charged with nitrogen and then fill it with the refrigerant and then eventually they phased it out entirely a couple years ago, and you always hear things i've been getting wind about.
You know different refrigerants drop in refrigerants and all these different things - and it's interesting that you know now - they say that 410a is not good for the environment either. You know it's better for the ozone, but it's not good, for you know the ground or the water. Whatever it is wrong with it, you know, don't don't hold me to that, i'm not a scientist, but basically they're, saying it's not good and we need another option now. Personally, i think that someone from the epa is having lunch with some of the manufacturers, and you know it some of the stuff they come out with.
You know it's it's crazy, but that's neither here nor there it's another topic. So, ultimately, what i wanted to do with this video is just to. I guess, warn you a little bit again. I might be early on this, but what we're being told is that some of the manufacturers have decided on a refrigerant that you know that they, because there's there's so many out there and they've supposedly narrowed it down, and that this is the refrigerant that they're going To use coming up moving forward, they're going to phase out 410 and go back to a you know, a refrigerant with a lower pressure and so on, and so what we're being told is that refrigerant is r 32 is what we're being told r32, not 22.
R32. 32, i have this little uh slideshow that was sent to me from one of our suppliers. I'm just checking a couple things uh. The slideshow unfortunately, is not very uh.
It's not like a powerpoint that i could throw it up and show you. So what i'm gon na do is just touch on a few things highlight a couple things that's in the slideshow and hopefully that'll help. The first thing that they're saying is that the r32 is 12 percent more efficient than the more uh when comparing apples to apples to a similar 410a system. So they're saying it's a little more efficient. So that's a good thing, they're saying that, because the pressures aren't as high some of the equipment will be lighter, you know they don't have to have quite as heavy. You know, thicker metals, which actually adds to the weight. Um they're saying it's better for the planet has a significantly lower total life cycle, refrigerant impact on the environment compared to 410a. It's easy to work with r32 refrigerant is easier to clean, reuse, recover and reclaim than non-azeotropic blends uh.
Over 100 million r32 units have been safely deployed worldwide. So that's actually a good thing. I think that you know ultimately, if they're going to be switching to something, it's good, that they've tried it right uh. I i think that that's not done enough, and especially in a lot of uh, the industries with products that we buy r32 is readily available.
It's non-proprietary, so you know everybody should be able to get their hands on it if they need it. It's uh now that they're saying this, but you know how this goes. This will probably change right now, they're saying it's a lower price per pound uh, it's historically lower price per pound than 410a and a much lower price per pound than most available proprietary low gwp blends. It's pure! It's not blended uh.
You know that's actually a good thing, a lot of these blended refrigerants uh. You know i i mean again, i'm not a scientist, but you know when you're talking about uh things that can separate and they're blended and things like that uh. You know a lot of times when these uh, you know compressors are starting and so on. They almost kind of got to get up the to speed and and get the pressures balanced and all this stuff and a lot of cases with blended refrigerants.
You know you might as well not even put your gauges on the system, for you know 15 plus minutes, and so this is going to be more pure and not blended, refrigerant. It's a single component refrigerant, making it easier to clean, reuse, recover and reclaim than blends widely available low refrigerant carbon footprint r32 systems can reduce the refrigerant carbon footprint by up to 80 percent as compared to r410a. You know, i think, that's ultimately the the goal in a lot of this they're trying to do better by the environment and so on. You may already be using an r32 as a key component and many other blended refrigerants interesting.
The r32 refrigerants gwp is 68 lower than 410as. It's efficient in harsh conditions according to this can be used in a heat pump and cooling applications in extreme cold and hot climates with excellent performance. 10 percent. More thermal capacity refrigerant is excellent at thermodynamic performance and about 10 percent, more thermal capacity than 410a.
Ultimately, what that's saying is you know the refrigerant it can probably transfer heat better and and all of that, so it's a you know much more better performance. That's basically it no glide. The r32 refrigerant has no negative performance impacts due to composition change, regardless of the type of heat exchanger. So that's kind of getting back to what i was saying a minute ago when the system's you know getting up and rolling with a blended system. This is saying that you know it has no glide designed for low total cost of ownership. So that's a good thing. Increased efficiency helps oem engineers design systems with low electricity consumption over the system's life. You know years ago, with our 22 systems, we were able to keep.
You know a handful of parts on our our vans and we could pretty much fix. You know on a late saturday night get folks up and rolling by replacing uh one of these parts and those days have uh changed. You know: there's hundreds of motors out there, there's variable speed, ecm all these different types and you know used to be able to keep four motors on the van and i could pretty much get most any residential system back up and going uh two for the you Know outdoor unit two different speeds and then two different voltage, indoor fan motors with different speeds, and you could pretty much get anybody back up and rolling r32 is a pure single component, refrigerant that doesn't change composition over time used around the globe. More than 40 manufacturers have chosen r32 as a replacement to 410a and their residential commercial hvac systems, so that is uh is actually a good thing.
You know, especially when it comes to these drop-in refrigerants for r22. You know we were seeing. You know this company was using this and this company was using that then it you know if you were to go behind them, it was just a you know: complete nightmare uh. Well, here's one! That's good! It's difficult to ignite! That's not the case with all refrigerants! R32 refrigerant requires approximately 100 times more energy to ignite than the propane commonly used in household appliances.
Lower charge r32 systems can reduce refrigerant charge in certain equipment up to 40 percent. So you need you'll need less refrigerant in the system, for it to still operate falls below many international gwp requirements. It's designed to draw less el electricity, so we kind of mentioned that before with the performance and what it's saying is it's also going to reduce the amount of energy consumption utility bills-wise. So that's a good thing for a homeowner design systems using fewer raw materials.
Oem engineers design systems that use fewer raw materials than comparable 410a systems, zero composition, change, easy to reuse and recycle i've kind of always had the idea or the it's just the way i was taught i if, especially, if i make a repair to a system and I've pulled a vacuum. I want to introduce pure new clean refrigerant into that system, but they're saying that this r32 is going to be easier to reuse and recycle compared to alternative non-azeotropic blends chargeable and liquid and gas forms. So that's again getting back to the blended refrigerants, you were not able to charge in gas form like we were able to years ago with r22 with refrigerants, like r410, you have to charge it in liquid only which uh has its own set of problems. You know it's not a huge problem, but it's possible to flood the compressor doing that you got to be careful and especially, if you don't know what you're doing components with a proven history, safe handling and many applications proven in more than 100 million units worldwide, 20 Plus million new units annually since its inception in 2012, r32 systems have become the global standard to reduce 410a and many hvac applications. So anyway, i i hope this helps. I don't again. I don't know what the future holds. I'm no psychic, but i think ultimately, what we're saying here is you know again, if you're watching this in the future, you might say well, duh uh it.
It's already made the change or whatever, but as of right now this is kind of new information they uh. They had talked to me about it, maybe a year or two ago, but i had heard the same thing about a bunch of other things too. So you know kind of goes in one ear and out the other. I think, ultimately, that what you should know is they are saying that they're forecasted to be coming out in 2021, at the end of 2021 they're, actually going to be manufacturing and sending out products with this new refrigerant in it.
What that means for you guys that now have 410a systems. I think you're fine for now and should be for a good while if they do anything like they did with r22, we were warning folks for years and years saying: hey it's coming! It's coming. You know you got ta, you know do something here and some folks held out and that's fine, but ultimately it will probably i'm guessing. 410A will be phased out.
So if you're in the market, uh for a new heating and air system and you're in griffon, air's coverage area in the middle peninsula or the northern neck of virginia, give us a call we'd love to earn your business. We'll give you a 12 year parts and labor warranty on our premium installs, and that beats everybody around here. I believe uh, if you're, not in our coverage area but you're in the market, for a new heating and air system. Before you spend thousands, you got to check out my new website.
New hvac guide, dot com, i'll put a link to it down in the notes, but ultimately this website was built almost like. I wrote a book so a book to say hey this is you know what you want to avoid a lot of the information that i've put on that website? Other contractors and hvac manufacturers? Don't even want you to know a lot of this information. I've got a whole page called no knows, and i've just put so much stuff on there. That i think, will help you and you know just check out that website before you go spending thousands, i think, it'll help you in several different ways. Please subscribe. Thank you for watching you.
I cannot even locate r32 here in usa. This is all a controlled scam just like the smog laws, its all about the dollars. If EPA was at all concerned about the ozone they better stop all these volcano's from erupting?
Should be using propane (R-290). A natural refrigerant.
All these synthetic refrigerants are much worse for the environment.
It's all a scam.
I agree its all about GREED, lets keep changing out equipment, 15 years is way too long for a homeowner to change out equipment. Great way to justify this is "CLIMATE CHANGE". What a crock of shit.
So all the talk is about R32 but how about Carrier and their decision to go with the proprietary R454b? And Carrier is branding it as Puron Advance. Are we going to see the industry split on this?
Can swap a r 410 a Compressor to a R32 ??
What's the refrigerant flavor of the year going to be now Mr Dupont! I lend out my R22, then realize I'm out, and price has quadrupled. Buy a little more and then my compressor goes to ground the next day. I need a 3 ton system before next season.. What refrigerant and brand would you suggest? Thanks.
First it was CFC tear a hole in the ozone. Now HCFC's are not environmentally friendly. WTF?
Manufacturers should be designing R290 propane or CO2 based systems. Are you in Orleans ?
Let's hope the reason they want to go to R-32 is not because they know that R-32 causes oil breakdown which leads to pump damage when the discharge temperature gets too high. I want to know the details about how they 100% fool-proof mitigate the problem of high discharge temperature on R-32 so that this does not happen and how reliable those technologies are. Call me cynical but I've seen too many "planned obsolesce" done by corporations, or even large groups of corporations in my days to believe that this is a good thing. Sounds like they're trying to push a system that requires an oil change every X many hours due to high discharge temperatures and if you don't get it done on schedule then you're looking at buying a new condenser unit. I have a feeling that all they care about seeing is all those dollar signs and they want to turn the entire A/C market into a jiffy lube where people are regularly forking over huge sums of money for expensive preventative maintenance that is required, not optional, and is also not a DIY job.
I just installed a new HVAC system in my home it was really easy but im also a ASE master certified auto mechanic and im also dealing wit this crap R134 to 1234YF had to buy new equipment Are you in Nepean ?
You guys will change to R32 eventually
Its flamable
Single refrigerant non blended no glide
Operating pressure are higher than410 a bit
Higher volumetric capacity use slightly smaller compressor and heat exchsngers
Its cheaper tzn R410a
Discharge temp on the compressor us higher compared to 410a. May affect life of comoressor oil
Y’all are behind. in Australia we switched to r410a in the early 2000 and r32 a few years ago
Another divorce of buyers, the 32nd gas is not new, it was used in the production of the 410th, the question is, if it is so good, then why was it not used before? Everything is simple, just the manufacturer decided to reduce the cost of its production, if earlier he gave us borscht with sour cream, now it's just borscht, but it's more expensive, as if it tastes better without sour cream, the same situation with freon, if 410 had to mix two freons to achieve fire safety and reduce toxicity, then now they said, but it will come off, but we will sell more expensive as know-how, having hung noodles to the consumer, they say it is better. And by the way, the air conditioner on 32 freon, you can refuel with freon 410 and nothing terrible will happen, since 410 already contains 32 and you can also add 32 to the air conditioner on 410. Pay attention. 32 freon costs more than 410, but it is more difficult to produce 410, since it consists of two freons Service area Orleans??
Очередной развод покупателей, 32-й газ не новый, его использовали в производстве 410-го, вопрос, коль он так хорош, то почему его не использовали раньше? Все просто, просто производитель решил удешевить свое производство, если раньше он нам давал борщ со сметаной, то сейчас просто борщ, но дороже, как будто без сметаны он вкуснее, та же ситуация с фреоном, если 410 надо было смешивать два фреона, чтоб добиться пожаробезопасности и снижения токсичности, то сейчас сказали, а сойдет и так, зато продадим подороже как ноу хау, навешав потребителю лапши, дескать он лучше. И кстати кондиционер на 32 фреоне, можно дозаправить фреоном 410 и ни чего страшного не произойдет, так как 410 уже содержит в себе 32 и так же можно в кондиционер на 410 добавить 32. Обратите внимание. 32 фреон стоит дороже 410, а ведь 410 произвести сложнее, так как он состоит из двух френов
The new refrigerant is Honeywell's Solstice® N41 (R-466A). But I posted this before R-32 announcement.
410A in NY $335 a can as of 07-02-21/ R-22 $900 a can
seeing that 410A will be phased out, in my position someone who wants to buy a first time mini split system from Daikin, what options do i have to not waste money on an investment that will be phased out. I've been quoted on the MXS system which uses the 410A but dont want to pull the plug if the refrigerant being used in it will be banned in a couple years and with the money i spent on the system id like to get more out of it. any advice would be appreciated thank you!
Cant argue with facts.. like all the “experts” below who base their whole experience off of what bob told him or whatever..
And it is for sure the epa who is doing this.. there is an entire publication they released about gettig rid of all flammable and anything remotely damaging tothe ozone.. i think honeywell made a new gas that is biodegradable and nob hazardous n all.. Service area Ottawa??
Yep and their making r134a illegal this year also… switching everything to that r1234 or whatever it is..
When do they make something you can mix with old system? I needed a compressor on a r22 so I had to upgrade a 10 year old system to 410a for the same price it would cost to repair the compressor. I think it’s all a hoax. Keep changing the laws on Freon and force folks to buy new systems, where’s our tax credits? Need a Freon to mix with any existing system or the govt need to pick up half the cost to replace. It’s just asinine. Are you in Kanata ?
I am now in the position to begin considering which systems to replace my home AC's with. I have two R22 A/C's: upstairs is 3 ton, and downstairs is 4 ton. I live in Houston, Texas, so it gets pretty hot. I am trying to decide if I replace full system/s to go with preon (R410a) or limp along & try to make it to next refrigerant (like R454b). Any ideas? But, people say that preon will be much more energy efficient than R22 systems and not much maintenance for next 10 years. Currently, upstairs was 2 gal low on freon, but guy just gave me that to get it working. But, lower one was freezing up and I think it needs evaporator coil repaired. So, tough decision. I was worried on prices, but now, I see it more wisely as looking at the Big Picture. So, the upfront costs scare me less, and I do plan to make a change. Just I wish I didn't know that R410a is being phased out in 2023, is what the AC guy was saying. But, I am glad that he was honest. Anyway, these are topics future videos — for you. But, I"ll watch this one now and see what you say.
Most important question of all, does it cool as good.
My r22 units 38 years old. Pressures down and lines not cold as it should. Ac man says 410a units 5 to 10 thousand dollars. Service area Barrhaven??
So….. DuPont’s patient expired again? Service area Kanata??
It's all bullshit…..they just change it to change it and keep the industry going….
Not good for Global Warming. EPA Core question :)))
I think it's BS. Same thing they said about eggs years ago. Where they said to many eggs brings up your cholesterol now they're saying eat as many eggs as you can to improve your health. I guarantee r32 will be phased out in 4-5 years also. This is another war for some idiot to make a huge profit off of. Just like global warming is a sham.
It's a obsolete game after a lot of systems are out there then they phase it out for somthing eles . NOBODY wanted R410A because of high pressure and fragmented nature of the blend . 32 After a time it will phased out for somthing eles . Only the Rich can afford a central system .. South Florida is miserable hot high humidity mold is everywhere. Getting back to lower pressures metering devices and compressor ratios will change don't know about the oil probably will remain synthetic.
In Europe, we have been using R32 for a long time now. no issues there. R410 has been out of market for years. its only available in commercial applications. its actually good because R32 is wayyyy cheaper than R410
just a picn and uh scratchin lmfao
Fox Family HVAC Youtube channel says the new refrigerant is going to be R-454b and be implemented Jan. 2023. Who is correct???
And R32 also makes a great dessert topping and/or floor wax. But what then can be dropped into an R410a system when R32 takes over????
"On September 26, 2016, the EPA announced that, under the EPA SNAP (Significant New Alternatives Policy) program, specific refrigerants including R134a and R410A can no longer be used in new chillers, effective January 1, 2024."
R410 is really bad because of very high Global Warming Potential (GWP), above 2000 (GWP of CO2 is 1). This is the reason. The R32 value of GWP is 677. I heard Honeywell is developing a refrigerant with GWP 4. R-717 (ammonia) has zero GWP.
In the year 2000 no one told me they were phasing out R-22.
What they don’t say, R32’s temperature goes up pretty high compared to R410A and degrades Poe oil faster and there by wearing down internal compressor components. And R32 also produces more acids so they need to add additives such as acid catches to the compressor oil else the expansion valve goes rusted. Apart from this I would agree with all the other pros of using r32gas.
If I am looking for a new residential air conditioner what type of refrigerant should I get do I have a choice. My old unit is R22 & I have to get a new one because it can’t be recharged.
Buy several tanks now while you can. I am getting a new system put in this coming week and it is a 410A system. I will be getting with my buddies to gather several tanks just for this reason. I currently have an old R-22 system that kills me in recharge cost, so to keep that from happening again I am buys my stuff now.
I do have a R410a Goodman 13 seer AC and it’s not old. If R410a gets phased out will it be safe to use R32 as a drop-in option for 410a systems?
Interesting, especially since I just installed a new 3T 410a system to replace my 30 year old r22. I read a little more about r32 and it seems it is half of the 410a mix. Strange that 410a was ever used at all considering r32 has been known about for a couple of decades, already adopted by other countries and seems to be better in every way. I really wonder if it is mostly politics, or what's best for the HVAC industry, or both, that determines decisions. I mean all of a sudden my 410a is bad for global warming. In a decade or two will r32 all of a sudden harm baby fur seals and the consumer will need to switch, at a cost of billions, to the new and safe "r42"?