Jim Bergmann, Founder of MeasureQuick shows how to charge and recover with MeasureQuick.
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and find our handy calculators at https://www.hvacrschool.com/
So we were standing here yesterday and I was just like listening and you know one of those things is you get as you get older and older and a little more experienced, not that Brian doesn't have any experience. You start to listen for things that maybe other people don't notice, and one of the things that I was hearing right away was a little bit of flashing in the liquid line here next to the dryer and Brian was telling me well, that's because you know it Gets to a bigger volume here and it flashes and to a liquid as it goes to the dryer. What I said I said: there's some turbulence as it yeah right. Well, you see the turbulence goes away.
You know one things here. Just so you at home can listen to exactly what I was listening to. You know put this mic up here, so you can hear that what you're hearing is just the sound of the liquid flashing in the dryer, and so we did some back of the napkin math and it indicated it might have some sub cooling. But we just didn't test it till today, we've hooked up to it.
You can see that we got low head pressure and we got you know. Six. Five tenths of the degree of sub cooling superheat looks okay, but Brian, and I pulled the evaporator open and took a look in there on one side of it's completely dry and the other side's pretty wet and Brian cities charged us in the past and runs pretty Low superheat so we'll get an idea here what's going on, but the other thing I wanted to take a look at was you know where we can add a couple things that are happening: let's go in a performance section now, if you want to zoom in there A little bit Brian, how close you are, but do you see we got lower than rated capacity or sensible capacities on the low side? Okay, latent capacity is also no signer. Sensible heat ratio is 0.8, Oh, which means we're doing a lot of sensible cooling, which makes a lot of sense because half the coil is dry, that we're doing a lot of sensible cooling.
So I'm real curious how that's going to look or compared one to the other here and I'm just going to take a screenshot of this just so we can compare it. So when we're all done here and what we did is we went through and just did a quick system profile. It's a 2-ton 410 a they not only set up here for 350 CFM per ton, 13 to 16 seer over the TXV superheat. It did benchmark this.
Go ahead and clear that benchmark out because they just benchmarked it at one time, we'll just give it a super heat of ten as a default, total external static pressure, okay, half an inch and we'll just hit submit there and then, as far as the ID goes. If you're curious at all, this is the model certain number off the carrier, we were able to barcode scan. These he's got bar codes. These are really nice when it comes to using measure quick for that, because you come in from the top and get the model number redline crosses.
You get the model coming from the bottom and get the serial number if they had to add it off two digits. There's two waiting digits here in a barcode. We just had to wipe off they're winning really nice and easy on there. So that is where we're at to start with. Why don't we go outside and let's take a look what's going out on outdoors we're adding charge? Because at this point the diagnosis is telling us that it's low? I mean we're low, so cooling cooling on the threshold for super heat. So we can hear the pulsation in a liquid line, which is a pretty good indicator that we are getting some flashing in there. We're gon na go outside and we're going to check it out and see what what it looks like after we've got a little bit of gas in it. So we're gon na go ahead and we'll just give this a little just gon na get out in there.
Yeah - and this really doesn't make that much difference because it's a it, doesn't have a lot of glide to it now. The other thing we did here - and I just like you know, so I grabbed a Valcour depressor on here and reason I like this - is right. Now, if you think about what's going on what's in the hose, is in the hose what's in the system, is in the system and when we get to charge right, what we're testing is the super meter. Subcooling is not what's in our hose, but what's in their system, the lot of guys used to take gas or the high side never back to the low side.
That's a bad idea, because that gas it's in the hose is not in a system. Then, once you dump it back over, you change your charge again, and a lot of systems today are really critically charged. So this this one's not as bad as some of you have like the micro channel stuff, but if you dump the gas back in the micro channel system, you're gon na have way way too much sub going on here. So we just drove this in so you know, add or remove gas here.
The other thing to take a look at here is down here to condensate. You can see we're just barely dripping. You got getting a little bit out of there, so the interesting to see if we get more condensate as we get more latent starts to work better. So we go over here the outdoor readings, where we can see the sub cooling.
Oh we're gon na go ahead and start adding some gas the machine we're in I'm just going to crack this open and we're not gon na. Do it too fast, I'm just gon na. Let it go in and flash a little bit and I'm just listening for my confessor see if we get any sound difference or anything like that. So now I can see my my suction is coming up here and I'm certain to throttle in the gas - and I just got my hand on here.
I can actually feel it flashing through here, because it's cool, I know I'm not dumping straight liquid into the compressor, and then I can watch my sub cooling here. If you slowly starting to eke out this, you get in now, remember gas has got to go in the suction side. It goes through the compressor it starts to fill up in the condenser, and then it backs up into the liquid line. That's what gets rid of all that flashing, where you're hearing in there and as it backs up in the liquid light, and it's going to start to fill the evaporator coil. So when you're anti gas and machine, you don't want to add it in too fast or you overcharge the system because it it takes time for the refrigerant to stabilize, because we're adding into one side we're balanced. It's going to balance out. That's when you inside the outside, so we get this up a little bit and then once you get it up a little bit, I've got ta close well throttling in so I'm gon na. Let it get a little bit faster here, we're going to so when we get this out, we got at least a degree or two or subcooling here factory target on this is 90 degrees.
I'll double check it here 11, and we change that in the targets here and measure quick, it's all about having good targets on here. So that's good brain print of that out. There check that we'll check that, but what we did any information section here and system info in the profile here is where we set the superheat with subcooling targets. So this is going to calculate plus or minus 3 degrees of 11 degrees is in the correct sone.
There, so we want to make sure if we're gon na get targets here that are correct. If this time it's going to be correct, we've got to make sure that we have the we've got to have the correct target to begin with in the in the app. So if I tap on this, you can see the target's 11, so it's 8 to 14 is the allowable range, and then you know we can obviously wear that, so we want to add refrigerant to there. I tell you down at the bottom here.
You know got to do this is a just-in-time education piece, so we're go ahead, we'll keep adding a little bit of refrigerant. To that. You can see that the high side pressure is starting to come up if we're certain looking at this enough in the trendline here. This is super heat and sub cooling, so you can see.
Are there sub cooling is increasing if you're going on it's coming up from zero, where it was at and we'll scroll through a little bit here. This is the suction line, tech we're starting to drop down, but that's just cause we're adding gas in machine liquid Ryan temps, dropping just a tiny bit and then we'll scroll through and get to the capacity here or the high-pressure. So you see, the high pressure is on the rise. It's trending upwards as well and gas, the machine they draw things that we'd expect to see here to go back to the home screen here and we'll go back to about six point: seven, seven degrees here.
So what I'm gon na do is just swallow this off for a minute here and let that start to stabilize because again it's a balancing act, we're waiting for that refrigerant just to normalize out here. So you can see. That's coasting the l-1011, and hopefully I didn't overshoot it here, we'll give it a minute. We'll see you just to be clear, though our targets are the green zones in these arcs, so we want to. We want everything to kind of settle in the green zone as best as possible, and that is a really low superheat on there Brian. If that's, if that's what you're, you're typically saying that runs a row that is run yeah, it does. It runs along and I've seen it run for quite often and again this is a classroom unit, so they tend to get abused, it's possible that we may have a valve. That's it's over feeding or but it'll be interesting to see on the evaporator coil.
You know what we get from a capacity standpoint, because screw back and took a peak here, we can probably get the readings from outside will hit performance on here. So you can see. Let me go back here. We'll definitely see their sense of what hit ratios coming down yeah and our capacities coming up to quite a bit actually yeah.
So let's go back and let's just take a look at what those numbers were beforehand, so we're at nineteen fifteen. Thirty, seven and point eight one: nineteen, fifteen thirty, seven and point eight one and now we're at twenty-one 15:52 and seventy five. Alright, that's looking a whole heck of a lot better yeah and we're just a hair on the high side on the sub cooling. But luckily is the classroom unit, so I'm sure you're gon na bore that gas out of here quicken sooner or later by accident.
But do you see a liquid line? Temperature dropped down quite a bit too. We had a low liquid line temp because we've got high sub cooling on here. We did just overshoot it and that's just how easy it is to do. You got to watch what you're doing you want to cut it off early, because it's a balancing act in there now we're only over by about a degree here, so we're right at the threshold of okay right, it's plus or minus three degrees, 11, plus three fourteen.
So we're still okay but we're on the high side we're out on right up there against the edge. We could dump a little bit out there, but it's really not going to make too much difference on here. It probably wouldn't even affect the head pressure. At this point on this on the machine, we're running high section and low superheat, which on a TXV system, is going to be a pretty good indication of an overfeeding valve at this point, let's go back through their approach, looks a lot better.
Compression ratio looks a little bit low, but again because it looks like that TXV is over feeding on their return supply. These are really good targets and that looks good on the supply and returning a wet bulb temperature splits, pretty spot-on air flow on the machine. I think we said it was right at 700, yep and 6.92 to go to a performance section. We can look at the detail performance, so this is doing 97.5 % of normalized capacity.
Ninety six point: one percent of a normal, sensible and one hundred percent we're late, and then we just lost it a little bit because we'll see if it comes back in here test, Oh clubs, running inside, so what we're right there. Everything is looking really good. As far as efficiency capacity, it doesn't measure the SCFM make sure we're looking at manufacturer's literature if you're looking at air flow you'll see it's as SCFM. That's standard cubic feet per minute. This is the amount of actual CFM required to achieve this SCFM goal and that just has to do with mass flow and air density across the coil. Adjusting for your actual we're dizzy in comparison, this standard air yep in temperature split with 21 degree split target emptor. Splits 22, so within a degree they're one point: four degrees: the humidification we're falling about four point: nine pounds an hour about half a gallon, an hour of humidity out, and it still just dripping there. But what we really picked up was was a lot of capacity on the machine and so based on this high suction we're running a low compression ratio which is actually good for efficiency.
The risk here with that low superheat is that we're running on the razor's edge of possibly flooding the compressor, which would be a problem, and i think you've said you insulated. The ball blown this i did previously, but then burt was messing with it and i think you pulled the insulation off all right. So, let's take a quick peek here: we've got a obviously right, be a loose TXV bulb could be restriction illiquid line. Now.
One thing you got to look at when you're looking at these faults here is that it's they might be made. Maybe maybe these are not definitive. It doesn't tell you for sure this is the problem with it. You have to actually physically look at some things.
We can go in there and check our liquid line. In fact, we just did check for restriction in there liquid line, so we measure the temperature inside all the way to the outside, make sure that liquid line was exactly the same temperature so that when we can clear out, I didn't physically check the bulb in their Movie we're going to check the bulb and see if the bulbs loose on there. This is why we got a slight overcharge of refrigerant if we go back to the back to this. Our head pressure is a tiny bit high and if we go back to our super heat and subcooling now we're actually probably take a little bit of gas out of there now so just it just overshot it a little bit.
So, let's get a tank with up a little gas out. You can see where we end up, give it a refrigerant charging, zomos things. If you do too fast or too slow like are too fast like I just did there. It is easy to overcharge, especially if you're a microchannel.
You got a slow way down here and there just flippers are too many streams and I didn't get back to it. Quick enough. Once you develop a liquid seal, things really start to change quickly, so it doesn't take a lot of gas. Once you get a one or a degree of sub cooling, you don't take much gas to raise it up. You know several degrees here and, as what we'll see is as we're the coldest right now if we look out here, let me just show you this real quick here on the outdoor. So outdoors, it's about eighty eight point, five degrees right and that approach is one point four degrees which is basically how close the liquid high temperature is to the outdoor air temperature and because we're you know we have this overcharge situation here. We've definitely got too much on that liquid light side before we count ways that head pressures through the roof, like that, Oh cuz, we're seeing keeps dumping in long after we get the tank down here. We'll get the way over church debt and you don't have to give you a covering machine out.
You can always take refrigerant from the high side of the system back into the tank and don't feel bad. These are mistakes. Everybody makes it could happen to the best of us now we're looking a lot better. Let's go back to your capacities are 20,000, total, 15 and 49 verses, nineteen, fifteen and thirty seven.
So we picked up four thousand BTUs a latent capacity and with nineteen fifty versus twenty, so yeah we picked up quite a bit. Yep set, that's the increase in mating capacity. We're looking for and subcooling looks, looks pretty good might give this one little tweak here. Just put that down just a hair and then I think we're good to go.
You can see how little that change the head pressure, but how much it changed. The sub cooling pretty pretty dramatic change there. So learn from what I did wrong: don't over charge. The system going to add the gas too fast, don't talk into videos while you're adding refrigerant, because you could overturn your system.
Let's just go through the rest of readings. Just take a look here so now I approach. Remember: approach was really really low before right. That's! That's looking good compression ratio is still on the low side, but we think we got an older feet and TXV they're up to take a look at that bulb on there supplying what M terms that all looks good on there.
Enthalpy change in enthalpy on the low side, but that's again because the section pressure pressures the driver for temperature transfer when this is high. It's gon na raise your coil top and that's going to change your enthalpy air flows right there, 693 702. So that works really good and that's what the manufacturers that target temperature, so it looks good and go back here. Our total, sensible, Leighton everything's nice range.
We go to her performance here: 95.8 % 95.9 %, 93 % of the latent load 0.76, so systems stable, which means that we can evaluate the charge at this point and we'll go in, and this is our weather data here. So you can see 87 degrees at 46 percent relative humidity, that's really quite dry for Florida. It did make a substantial improvement in their sub cooling. Still at thirteen point, six, I'm going to back just a hair more out of this. It's not a big deal that we're. You know a couple degrees over on sub cooling, but why do you take the time to do it and get it right? Because you can you know, there's no really the closer. It is to manufacture specification, the better machine's gon na run overall, let's take a peek at that's super super heat again see if we're still hunting or we're stabilized. So it looks like we're actually starting to stabilize a little bit too now now we're getting a little bit closer there and well, that's not a really high sub cooling or super heat number six degrees.
Six to eight degrees is pretty typical. What we're seeing today we're seeing lower super heats and we use to see in the past, so I'm not at all worried about that. I think we got it pretty figured out. Let's take one more peak here at a performance so 2015 and forty seven versus about a thousand forty-seven about a thousand BTUs.
We picked that mostly on the right hand, side mostly light and cooling. We picked up on the machine, so there you go that that pretty much wraps it up. Let's go inside now and let's listen to that dryer and see what it sounds like all right. There you go yeah.
It doesn't quite sound the same. No, it's a lot. Quite order to put your hand on it, you can feel actually you feel like quite a temperature drop. You can feel the and also the pulsations are gone on there yeah.
So there you have it all right. I can't tell it's got a koozie on it. It's very see: that's the problem with beer can cold. We had started to insulate.
No, I do put koozies on the line now nobody can tell so we have to use super heat and sub cooling to check the charge. All right lesson is: get you charge right using measure quick and don't over charge the heck out of it? That's right! You.
Is the gas R410a?shouldnt be charged as liquid?
Hi dear sir:why didnt you charge system with liquid or didnt upside down the gas container?
Good video but it fails to mention what probes are being used. There must be more than just the outdoor Fieldpiece shown.
Real world mistakes requires a level head to mitigate a solution right?
Great job and video like always
If you know the superheat was low why not close the txv off and bring it up first? Then your subcooling would have come up. Maybe not low on charge at all.
Thanks for Share , greetings from Méxicali ,México.
Thank sr for this video muchas gracias Bryan orr
What is the probe connected to after the core depressor tool before it connects to the charging hose? Are you in Orleans ?
Great job
More of these videos please. 😀
Love this type of education. Good stuff as we move forward. Service area Kanata??
Jim you are da man …. that's what's the measure quick app told me after I typed the numbers in lol
Can you tell me the model number of the testo probe set. Thankyou
Money 👍🏻 Service area Nepean??
Very cool video but I do disagree with one point Jim Bergman made about sweeping your gauges. There are no residential split systems that are critically charged to the point that sweeping your manifold gauges back into the system will put your subcooling over an acceptable range unless you overcharged the system to begin with, but the 6 oz that all 3 hoses hold should not affect you that much
Very good video even with all the complications 👏👏👏👍👍👋👋
Thanks for the video. Correct me if I'm wrong but that refrigerant is now fractionated. Because it is a blend it needs to be opened as a liquid and charged as a liquid. Because the blends escape at different rates Service area Barrhaven??
testo doesnt make anything like the i manifold has where it makes the blutooth work better does it?
MeasureQuick is the cats meow! 👍⚡️👍⚡️
If the liquid line sounds like that but you do have measured subcool it's a dead giveaway for non cons too.
Holy Jim B went balls to the wall on that charging 🤪
Great video
Spetacular video! Real world stuff is the best for learning. Listening/feeling the dryer is a great tip too. Thanks guys.
Take that freon out of his check Brian. Are you in Ottawa ?
The A+ team in action, for sure. What a treat watching two of the best in the business. 😎