What's up everybody, this is kayla with hvac school and i am here with hunter collins, k-lo services. We both work at calos and we're going to do a quick video to test out the blueon tech support that you can get through the app. If you have been accredited, you have access to the app and the entire library of systems and of manuals and conversions and stuff like that that they have through the app and all, along with all of the training information that they have. But they also have a training, uh, sorry, a tech support line that you can call 24 7.

and what we're going to do is we have three sample calls that we're going to use to call and just kind of see just kind of gauge the waters as Far as the quality of the tech support that we're going to get from blue on i'm assuming we're going to get different guys every time, these guys do not have the questions ahead of time. So it's an organic call, and this is right here - the the blue on tech support line. So here we go all right, so our first call is going to be regarding a humidity issue. This was a call that um we experienced in in wilmington north carolina um.

It was a goodman system, it was a three and a half ton unit, which was already a little oversized for the space that he was inhabiting the airflow. Apparently, at some point a technician came over and replaced the blower motor in the air handler in the attic, and it was a larger blower than was than what it came with from the factory. So the setting was on high. They were, they did a a flow hood test, i believe, and they got about 1600 cfm total system cfm, and so the humidity was super high.

Obviously you know for for obvious reading reasons. The the coil was running warm um, it was short cycling and you know it was already oversized, so it was just exacerbating the issue um. What we ended up doing uh was that they they lower the fan speed. We got down to like an 1100 cfm total system airflow and that corrected the issue.

It hasn't solved the over the oversized problem, but that is that is ultimately what we had an issue with was our delta t was, you know a little off once we lowered that fan speed, we got that humidity down um a lot blue on tech support. This is nathan, hey nathan. This is a hunter with uh calo services, hey hunter. How are you good? How are you doing not too bad man? What can i help you with? I got a system here.

We've been having some humidity issues, i'm getting about a reading about 62 percent uh humidity inside the home. Everything else checks out. The pressures are good. My delta t everything else checks out.

Just fine um. Have you checked your uh fan setting? Yes, what your fan speed is. Yes, what is your fan? Speed uh set to high set the height. I would take that.

Where are you located in wilmington, north carolina and the air? The airflow is also the airflow is uh we're getting about 1600 right now, cfm? What size system you're working on the three and a half ton three and a half ton? Oh yeah, sixteen hundred three and a half tons. So if you're in a high humidity area, i definitely suggest lowering that fan speed down in order to get a little slower. Slow airflow that's going to help uh. Take that humidity out going to cool your coil down a lot more um and get the humidity out a lot better than running that high, so typically like to see about 350 cfm per ton um in the high humidity area.

Um, that's i'm located down here in south florida and that's that's where i got mine dialed into oh. I hear you, i hear you right about 350.. I hear you um also also the duct is sweating, pretty good amount too. The ducks sweating yeah we're at like in the attic or or where we're at yeah in the attic yeah.

So that could be um. You need to make sure it's well insulated and also you don't have any leaks in there like seal that duct work up. Okay, so i would check for check for leaks in the ducts um and and check make sure that you're translated well with the uh duct board or or metal duct. It's it's duct board board with flex yeah.

You probably got some leaks going on in there. So i would definitely feel around to see where you have some leaks. Okay, see if you got leaks, then seal that up with some mastic, okay, cool cool anything else you got for me nope, i think that'll be it. I appreciate it all right.

Yep, no problem. Thank you all right, bye-bye, okay, so this second call um. This is going to be regarding a low voltage short. It is blowing the fuse.

So we let's say: we've got a three amp fuse um on a on a circuit, a low voltage circuit and we are owning out or sorry where we're amping out high on the yellow wire. So the contactor wire going to the contactor contactor is not actually ever pulling in it's just tripping automatically, but without a call, it's perfectly fine, we've visually inspected everything, nothing seems off no loose connections. Everything is good, immediately blows the fuse as soon as we reset that and we get a call for cooling or for heating. We we've tested all the other components.

We know that we've narrowed it down to the to the y circuit and just spoiler alert. The issue here is we have a shunted contactor coil. So basically, if you owned out that contactor coil, you would read really really really low resistance. What happens is it's not doesn't have enough resistance, so the amperage goes up and you end up with a blown fuse.

You have to keep in mind that just owning out a regular contactor without reference to a good contactor. You know that can be. You know problematic, because then you don't know what it should breed to begin with and it's an inductive load. So it's going to change with the occurrence of reactive power.

If it's reading really really low resistance to begin with, then you're not even going to be able to make it to the closed uh contactor it's going to completely blow the fuse because of over ramping. So and that's what we are discovering here on this particular call. The the guy that we're about to call has absolutely no idea about this issue, so we're going to kind of test his knowledge on low voltage circuits and i'm troubleshooting a low voltage short here we go hey mark. This is a hunter with calo services.

How are you doing good? How are you i'm doing great, i'm doing great awesome man, i'm at this system and for some reason, the uh low voltage fuse, which is a three amp fuse, keeps blowing checked all my wiring. I don't see any rub. Outs, nothing's touching everything, looks good to me. I'm just kind we're of the fuse for a reason right what components are tied into it.

Um i have my pan switch and my secondary float switch. It's just the two switches, two switches. Yes, okay, one one thing we could do is we could um put an ohm meter on each of the switches individually to see if there's a high resistance on the switches and we could turn around and take each one of them out of the circuit one. At a time, we're gon na lose a fuse or two that way, but yeah um, no i've actually already um.

I've actually already taken the switches out one at a time isolated them. It's just a normal, just a normal. It's a heat pump. So i've got the reversing valve and this is going to the thermostat like normal.

Okay, so you've got the reversing valve in there the reversing valve relay in there anything with the thermostat. If you check the wiring at the thermostat to make sure that there's nothing shorted in there, yes, i have so you bumped out all your all your wiring and everything yeah i mean about the best we can do is to go through and check everything one at A time because it's either got to be wiring or it's got to be one of the devices that's pulling an excessive current when it tries to engage okay. What about the uh? Do you think i should check the the uh the amperage on each wire? Well, you know you could put a depending upon what kind of a meter you're using you can use a fluke. That'll go up to 10 amp, i'm just using the regular compact filled piece, but it has an amp clamp on it.

So, okay, it's just three amps kind of down far down on the uh on the scale, so it may be a little hard to catch it. Okay, um, have you made sure there are no loose connections on any other commons or anything like that? Yeah. 24. Volts! Yes, this is a 24 volt application.

Yeah i've made sure everything's tight um, like i said, no skin wires, nothing rubbings, nothing's, rubbing or anything. Is there one of the secondary wires that goes to ground office of the transformer? No okay, so we got a floating secondary. That was going to be. My next step was to check the amperage.

How many fuses have you put in two? So chances are you're actually seeing that kind of an amperage i mean you can you can check it, but it's gon na if it's popping them realistically quickly, it's gon na go quick. You know if you've got a um like a max capture on the meter. You can use that it'll it'll show you where it actually blows out, but it sounds like we've got a short or is it blowing the fuse okay pulling in like a contactor or anything like that? Well, i just checked the amperage on the on the uh. All the wires and on my yellow wire, i actually got around six amps.

You got six amps on the yellow wire yep, so that's most likely to be going to your compressor contactor right. So i just want to clarify one thing: real, quick. What we did mike was right using a compact meter like any your regular. You know multimeter trying to amp out one of the wires um if you've got an immediate fuse blowing.

That's that's not going to really do much good because it's going to blow so quickly. You're not going to really be able to read whatever minimal amps you're going to get it might be too quick. So what we should have done was told mike that what we did was we ice. We came to the thermostat, we put a little popper or some sort of resettable fuse inside the air handler and we disengaged each addition.

Each um individual wire and jumpered each one individually to to red and then until we finally got the fuse to to reset or to blow so that would have been able to a much better way more practical way in the field to be able to isolate, which Circuit has the short, and of course, if we did this, and we had the issue that we were talking about a shunted coil um. If, as soon as we jumpered yellow to red, then we reset power. That would immediately trip the fuse, and we would know that that, on this circuit, the y circuit is our issue just want to clarify that. That's something that we should have done mike from blue on was absolutely correct, um in in the way that he uh explained things we were a little off on in the way that we attacked the problem.

Have you looked at look at your compressor, contactor and see if there's, if you've got a contactor, that's hanging up that isn't allowed to pull all the way in they will pull excessive, excessive current okay on the coil? Okay, what happens is it? Doesn't it doesn't? Let the contactor pull all the way in to close that the magnetic area of the coil, and so it's it's holding way out, and so that will cause excessive current draw. Okay. So that's that's! That's what i would look at and in the case of a lot of those contacts, if they're you know not pulling in, you, can sometimes open them up and clean them. But if it's pulling six amps it's way way over right right.

Do you think uh? Do you think, maybe i should own the contact route? I don't think only it's gon na show you anything because it's the magnetic field and not being able to pull the contactor and pulling the really high current okay. Why is that? Well? Have you ever worked with a solenoid and plugged the solenoid in put voltage through the solenoid without the solenoid on the solenoid valve? Yes, i have what happened. You burn up the coil. Yes, it's because it's looking for that magnetic yeah, so um i i would say that it's in that coil, that's not being allowed to pull in all the welding.

So i mean i would look at the contactor mechanically. You can't own it right and what happens if it owns pretty low, though, like i'm getting i'm getting about it, one and a half ohms. Well, you have to compare it to a good one to see what the good one is running. Yeah doug i have.

I have a couple more on my van um and i i i compared them to that and i'm getting about see. I got one and a half on this one, but on those uh, the good ones, i'm getting around seven seven and a half. Well, if you've got that kind of a deviation, then i would say change the contractor and you may have something you know a turn to turn short inside the coil. Okay, all right! Well, i appreciate it mike, not a problem all right.

Thank you, sir. Have a great one: you do you too, you have a great day all right, all right, bye-bye all right, so this third call is going to be specifically blue on related, so a lot of uh their conversion. You know processes, they'll, say: hey, replace the low pressure switch um, let's fine-tune so to speak, the the metering device, you know say if you got an adjustable txv, but what i kind of want to do is pick their brain about why that is. We know that you know blue on is operating at lower pressures, but specifically, you know what about you know: low ambient cooling things like that things that i want to get kind of an idea more clearly.

Why they've put these procedures in place um for retrofitting processes? Um, so we're going to call call again see what we can get and kind of pick their brain up. A little bit about the blue on process itself for retrofitting, and just generally speaking about the the new bid tool that they have in the app they just released this a couple of months ago, and you can actually see you know how many on average, i'm assuming. How many hours that this particular retrofit's going to take and how many pounds of the tdx 20 refrigerant that this system is going to hold blue on tech support? This is brian: hey! What's up brian's caleb with calo services, hey caleb, how you doing man good man? How are you doing? I've got a um, i'm doing another uh blue on retrofit over here. It's a package unit, so it's an indoor style package unit, okay, yep, it's a it's just straight ac air cooled and um.

I just had a couple of questions about specifically the um, the low pressure switch and the metering device. All right, cool, yeah um, so go ahead. Well, my question was going to be: what machine are you? What machine are you working on? I understand it's an indoor floor mount but yeah, it's um. It's a carrier units um.

50. 50. Bravo, victor echo, zero, two, zero um, okay, yep all right! So it's an old carrier stand up beautiful, yep, yep, so um. I i noticed the high pressure and the low pressure cut out.

It looks like they're standard, but why would i need to replace those to begin with on any system? The low pressure switch would be because uh, some of them use them as a pump down control. So they're they're set in the high 30s and if you're, still using the pump down you'd, be all right with a 35 but again depending upon what you're running temperature wise and that stand up unit should not be affected. But you look at the cut out of the low pressure switch if it's a pump down system or if it's borderline uh. What you're going to be running with blue ons pressures? I gotcha okay and, i would probably say 90 of the units that are out there.

You don't actually have to change the low pressure switch, but you want to look at it to make sure that it's a uh fail, safe, bail, safes, typically trip at 26 pounds or less, whereas operating pressure controls, something that was going to be a bump down would Be higher than that and you don't want to have false trips, i gotcha yeah okay, so because the tdx 20 is operating at lower operating pressures, you just don't want it to go off too soon prematurely yeah, because we run about a 10 pound. We run approximately 10 pound less suction than our 22, and then you know you also mentioned the high pressure safeties yeah uh. Typically, we don't have to change those ever because we're we're not going to have a problem tripping. If you lose a air cooled, you lose a condenser fan motor.

You know you're gon na trip at 425 and we're perfectly safe with that. So the high pressure switches generally don't have to be messed with at all. It's when you get into the fan cycle controls where you're maintaining head pressure when you got low ambient conditions and the machine still needs to ask for cooling and to be able to take full advantage of the energy savings, then you can just tune them down to Shut off the fans at 200, most of them have a 35 differential built into them, so you bring it down to 200 pound cut off that'll, bring it back on 235, instead of like 22, where you're maintaining more of a 250 pound hit. Okay, make sense! No! Absolutely so, then, what about these uh metering devices then because i've heard that there's a lot of adjustment - or i guess for lack of a better word - fine tuning, so to speak of these retrofits for blue on i'm.

Looking at the machine go ahead on the machine that you mentioned, the carrier 50 bv, that's going to have an adjustable expansion valve okay and yeah and that that will need to be adjusted. You kind of have to make up for the pressure difference between 22 and uh glue on so knowing going in that you're gon na have to adjust the valve in one to four turn to be able to make up that uh pressure difference. Now that's one to four turns closed right. Yeah one to four turns closed yeah.

If you're opening there's something else going on with the system right, that's a that'd be a flag. So yeah, it's one to four turns closed tightening up the spring. Okay. So maybe that maybe that makes more sense to by saying tightening up the springs, because you have to make up the 18 pound difference that you're seeing yeah.

No, that makes sense. Okay, yeah interesting um. So we should i'm looking at the retrofit and everything and there's a looks like it appears as though that there's this thing um in the app called bid this job now, i'm already here. But it says that you know 14 hours, labor 17 pounds of refrigerant which matches uh just pretty closely to the original factory charge.

Um is this i'm assuming this is a new tool, that's within the app? Yes, we just added the bids, probably the biggest job portion of the apps, probably two months old at most, and they were also working on adding another one fyi to you, that's going to be including all the parts it's going to be. It's going to be pretty fantastic when we get done so we're we're collecting more data so for every piece of equipment we've got in the app you're gon na be able to order right from your local vendor through the app which has nothing to do with us. You're going right to your uh and ordering the order and the parts either we'll call or deliver in some cases. No that's cool, so yeah, it's gon na be pretty sweet, but going back to the business job that is kind of a mid-range.

Give you an idea. If you're bidding the job, this is what it's like. You kind of, have to look at the conditions. Whether you know is the machine easily accessible or you're working off of a 20-foot ladder.

So you see, there's ranges the refrigerant. You know the amount of refrigerant is going to be kind of based off of our rule, of thumb of you end up at 90 or 95 of the original charge, oh okay. So when you're, when you're looking at the job, so if it's a really difficult job you're going to want to go on the high end of the labor uh or if it's you know, walk right up to it and sit on the ground. Next to your truck, you probably get away with the lower end gotcha.

Okay! Now that's that's still really helpful. That's awesome! Well we're trying man we want to. We want to make it as easy as possible for the mechanics that are out there and we we kind of understand the headaches of it from uh doing it. Like you know, being 40 years in the trade we got uh, mikey and nate and david - and you know all this all these years sitting around right here at home at our own shop.

So it's kind of cool to have these guys and be able to get guys off the job, and it's not just for conversions. You know the guys can call for uh well any any issues, any hvac related issues. What about design issues like like uh? You got an oversized piece of equipment or you've got negative or negative pressure. Zoning and stuff like that, call you guys for that too.

I you know what i've never turned down anybody's questions, so uh yep. If i got to dig into the weeds a little deeper, i've been on guys, uh been on calls with guys for uh three days of shot. If you will it's like four hour conversation here, uh next day, go back he's doing some more tuning, so yeah. We will actually take the time that they need whatever their need, is so design questions i'll get in i'll get into the books.

Maybe i won't solve it in a in a 30-minute conversation and and have to call back or set up more more talks, but yeah. Absolutely that's awesome man. I appreciate the help. No, it's my pleasure man.

All right. Man take care, you do the same, caleb brother, he all right. You too.