We've known for a while now that 410a refrigerant is going away eventually. However, one thing we haven't known is the exact date, during the phase-down of 410a refrigerant, that HVAC manufacturers will have to STOP producing equipment with 410 in it. Now we do! The EPA has come out and said Residential and light commercial air conditioning and heat pump systems must have a GWP lower than 700 by January 1, 2025.
EPA's proposed rulemaking can be found here: https://www.epa.gov/system/files/documents/2022-12/Prepublication_HFC%20Restrictions%20NPRM.pdf
For more information on the rule and how to comment, as well as information on the virtual public hearing, please visit www.epa.gov/climate-hfcs-reduction.
On December 30, 2022, at 11 a.m. Eastern time, EPA will host a virtual hearing here: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/us-epa-public-hearing-on-proposed-technology-transitions-rule-tickets-490493327747
The 45-day public comment period for this proposed rule will close on Monday, January 30, 2023. The public docket can be viewed at www.regulations.gov by searching for docket number EPA-HQ-OAR-2021-0643. For more information on the rule and how to comment, visit www.epa.gov/climate-hfcs-reduction.
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Chapters
0:00 Intro: Date Announced for 410a elimination
0:53 Timeline
1:49 EPA rule making phase one
2:44 EPA rule making phase two
2:56 Public Hearing
3:14 Meaning to Homeowners buying HVAC
4:22 Homeowners wanting to buy new refrigerant equipment
4:45 Price Increases
5:28 Date not set in stone
5:49 If you have a 410a system
6:27 GWP ratings
7:54 Outro: 410a may be like R22 phase-out
#410a #epa #hvaclaw
EPA's proposed rulemaking can be found here: https://www.epa.gov/system/files/documents/2022-12/Prepublication_HFC%20Restrictions%20NPRM.pdf
For more information on the rule and how to comment, as well as information on the virtual public hearing, please visit www.epa.gov/climate-hfcs-reduction.
On December 30, 2022, at 11 a.m. Eastern time, EPA will host a virtual hearing here: https://www.eventbrite.com/e/us-epa-public-hearing-on-proposed-technology-transitions-rule-tickets-490493327747
The 45-day public comment period for this proposed rule will close on Monday, January 30, 2023. The public docket can be viewed at www.regulations.gov by searching for docket number EPA-HQ-OAR-2021-0643. For more information on the rule and how to comment, visit www.epa.gov/climate-hfcs-reduction.
For more information on Griffin Air, visit https://www.griffinair.net/
For more information on New HVAC Guide, visit https://www.newhvacguide.com/overview
*Need Financing for your HVAC? Visit https://www.newhvacguide.com/financing
*Own a Service Biz and want to grow? Visit https://www.newhvacguide.com/mastermindgroup
*Our favorite products?
Favorite Thermostat click here: https://amzn.to/3FQg6X7
Favorite Air Cleaner here: https://amzn.to/3Nfxw27
Favorite Air Filter here: https://amzn.to/3vpVbWl
Air Tester/Monitor here: https://amzn.to/3oJ3LvD
Dehumidifier here: https://amzn.to/3Q4woPp
Humidifier here: https://amzn.to/3ilZ9vq
Smart Vent here: https://amzn.to/3JDfGDX
Soft Start USA: https://softstarthome.com/griffinair/
Griffin Air LLC is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to amazon.com. Amazon offers a small commission on products sold through their affiliate links. Each of your purchases via our Amazon affiliation links supports our cause at no additional cost to you.
Chapters
0:00 Intro: Date Announced for 410a elimination
0:53 Timeline
1:49 EPA rule making phase one
2:44 EPA rule making phase two
2:56 Public Hearing
3:14 Meaning to Homeowners buying HVAC
4:22 Homeowners wanting to buy new refrigerant equipment
4:45 Price Increases
5:28 Date not set in stone
5:49 If you have a 410a system
6:27 GWP ratings
7:54 Outro: 410a may be like R22 phase-out
#410a #epa #hvaclaw
We finally have a timeline on the new refrigerants that will be coming out and when you're going to be able to buy the products with these new refrigerants in them. Up to this point, if you've been keeping score. Uh, we've done videos on the aim Act and the phase out of 410A refrigerant but up to this point we have not had a specific timeline a specific date that we would see products that are going to be rolled out to the public to you know be purchased during the making of this video. If you buy a heating and air system, it's still going to have 410A refrigerant in it.
So you know that's one thing that we've had questions about. We've had people comment on our videos about because they're wondering, they're hearing all this stuff, They're hearing that fortune is going away. But when is this stuff coming out? Maybe they want to go ahead and make the leap. Maybe they want to go and buy the equipment with the new refrigerant in them And so here.
Uh just in the last couple weeks we have a our article that's come out that is talking about how the EPA has a proposed rulemaking dealing with the plans to ban 410A refrigerant. So you know this is the first time we've with this whole phase out thing. we've had a a specific timeline I did a video on that where we talked about this year we're going to phase out 410A about 10 and then by you know this next year or three years later we're going to be at this percent and by the year 2036 410A refrigerant with all refrigerants really with Hfcs will be phased out by 85 percent in the US. Well this is the first time the EPA has proposed anything with an actual timeline that says this is the date that the new stuff needs to be out, that you need to stop making the equipment with this old refrigerant in it the old refrigerant being 410A And so this new proposed rule has two stages.
The manufacturer or import of the products would be prohibited by either 2025 or 2026. The reason there's two two years is it depends on the type of system you have. If you're watching this video and you have you know a home you're looking at you know, replacing a typical Residential Heating and Air system air conditioning with the refrigerant in it, then it's going to be the 2025 number. It's not going to be that later number that later number is going to be for.
You know, Vrf systems and some you know other sectors of the market like refrigeration and transport. Refrigeration Things like that. Um, you know I'm not going to get into all of that. Maybe we'll do a video on what falls on what year.
But basically if you're watching this video and you're a homeowner and you are purchasing a heating and air system for your home, it's going to be that 2025 January 1st by 2025.. that would be the first of the two stages and then the second of the two stages would be a year later a Prohibition on the sale, distribution offer for sale or distribution, export and other activities pertaining to these products. And so the EPA has a process. They come out with this and then they have a public hearing. I'm going to put a link down in the description of this video to the public hearing that they're going to be having and the EPA will accept comments on this proposal for the next 45 days after publication. So what does this mean for you as a homeowner? I Think what it means is we now finally have a deadline. A lot of folks were misinformed or just simply not reading or following you know what is actually coming out information wise and we've even had people comment on our videos saying well, Josh You know the new standards where the Seer ratings are going up. The CR2 rating is now coming into effect January of 2023 and that's when the new refrigerant would be out and you know the obviously that's not the case And so we did a video that went through that this is the first time we've actually had a timeline where the EPA is saying look, this is going to be the the date that we want this.
You know this equipment won't be sold and so that means leading up to that. The manufacturers need to get their butts in gear and you know have these products coming out being able to be purchased. Hopefully right in a perfect scenario before then. So this is the first time we've actually had that set in stone date that they're saying that this is going to be the date that everything needs to be switched over by.
you know by then everything should be switched over and I would say and I Think you would probably even agree with that. Most homeowners, if they are in the market for heating and air system, they're not wanting to. you know, buy the old refrigerant stuff anyway. You know, as long as they don't have to now again, during the making of this video, you have no choice.
But as we move closer and closer to that deadline as these products come out, you're going to see folks you know make that switch now. I Don't know if we're going to see a price increase, We probably will. They look for any reason to raise prices these days. Even with this new efficiency ratings kicking in for 2023, we saw where they were taking the same exact systems that had a Seer one rating and it's the same exact system.
Same amount of metal, same amount of paint on the unit, same amount of refrigerant. It's the same exact system, but now it has a CR2 rating attached to it and so all of the manufacturers across the board are saying. Now with the new standards, we're raising our prices again. So that just tells you that they're going to look for any reason to raise their prices and that'll be the case with this new refrigerant as well.
If I was a to guess Tom will tell right? Anyway, the point is, uh, you know they've now finally rolled out a date. that date is not set in stone yet. but you know if anything's like it has been in the past when they roll out a date like this, they're going to take comments and and so on from the public. but this is probably going to be. You know the date that it's going to happen and through this whole aim Act and the phasing out of 410 if you have a 410A system right now, uh, don't lose sleep, you still have time. It's not like that. You know as soon as these new systems come out, you're no longer longer going to be able to get 410A refrigerant for your system anymore. But as the years go on, you know, as we see the phase out of this refrigerant just like refrigerants in the past like R22, you're going to see the price of it go up.
you know? So during the making of this video, whatever that price is now as time goes on, you'll just see it start to bump up more and more as it becomes harder to get. You know the supply and demand kind of thing and so we're about to wrap up. But the last thing I wanted to point out is unlike the recent change in California where they said that you know they were going to enact where systems could not be sold with a Gwp level of 750 or above, this new rule coming out from the EPA has gone even further and said that Nationwide they don't want systems sold above 700. So 700 is going to be your Gwp rating.
Obviously 410A is much higher than that. And so you're going to see these new refrigerants have to meet those types of Standards they're going after it all. You know this is not just residential systems. they're going after chillers.
They're going after ice makers. They're going after whatever. You know, Anything that creates cold, uh, air or water or whatever, uh, this is going to affect that in the next, you know, several years. The other thing that's interesting is with that whole 700 gwp.
with some of these other products like chillers or ice makers, we are seeing a different Gwp rating being attached to those so you know some of them being as low as 150. where they're saying that if you have an industrial refrigeration system that you know the highest Gwp you're going to be allowed is 150. So they are really, you know making these changes. They've now given us a date, they've given us a timeline and this is a sign of things to come again.
I'll put that link down below. let me know your thoughts. We're going to keep a close eye on this as things can continue to come out regarding this, but we've been looking for this. We've been wondering how this is going to pan out, what's the date? and we finally have one! So January 1st 2025 410A You will not be able to buy those systems anymore.
Uh, at least with the 410A refrigerant in them. It could be something similar to R22 where we were able to buy the units for a little bit longer after that, but they were dry charged. they were. You know they had nitrogen in the unit and then you would have to supply the refrigerant to the systems.
Maybe that's how this is going to play out? We'll see, but we now finally have a date on it. That's something we haven't had. So anyway, let me know your thoughts. Hit that like button. Hit that subscribe button and we'll see you next time.
As a commercial and industrial technician, my thoughts that is if the EPA forced the companies that manufacture HVAC equipment to make better equipment that doesn't leak all the time then we wouldn't need to worry about changing refrigerants every 20 years. All the EPA does is drive up prices for everything.
This industry is so screwed up thanks to 0bama and Biden! I so glad I'll be retiring in 5 more years from this shit show trade!
r22 units were bullet proof. Doesn't matter what company you went with they would last a while. But I don't know why but im in houston Tx 410a just leak more and ive changed more 410a compressors and at my house both r22 units running and working for 22 years. just changed capacitors 1 contactor and 1 fan motor other than thay never changed anything nothing changed on both furnaces still running.
the new 410 replacement is gonna run at 900psi 🤣😂😅
Just stupid!!
To anyone here complaining it's just a scam. Give us some facts. Just thinking out loud like you're doing makes you look stupid.
It's all about money. Last year price of 410a went up over 400%. I can guarantee the replacement will be more expensive.
its all dumb. this is were evolution goes backward. were going to start shipping ice back from the northole. LMAO idiots running things. remember the prohibition. if its a chemical its not safe according to them. even the cavemen were in danger lol.
How are they 3 deep on common refrigerats that they are banning
My A.C. unit still run after 22 years on R22, just curious how much is a lb of R22 going for? Thinking about refilling this summer.
I installed several ice machines that use 410a. Most water source heat pumps are 410a. It’s BS.
What about apartment complexes?
R32 is more efficient
We still have tons of customers with r22 systems. We as a company still have a lot of r22 jugs to go thru.
Is someone lying to us or just trying to make money
410a patent ending?
My Diakin mini split is R 32 which is 6 years old, refrigerator R 600 A, 7 years old, both said at the time to be more efficient alternatives to R 410 A. Am I missing something or is the U.S. slightly behind the times ?
Guess who still gets to use R12 – The government.
Why can't they just fix leak in evaporator and recharge my 9 year old unit instead of making me buy a $12,000 inverter controlled unit? Are you in Orleans ?
What are they planning on replacing it with
Is this a shell game? Phase out refrigerant every 20 years??? Make people buy new stuff. Profit???
Let’s go back to 22 units with lower seer ratings that would run reliably for 20 years!
Sorry to bust your bubble, but you are WRONG! Several Big refrigerant users (think animal/food processors) and refrigerant manufacturers have already taken steps for a lawsuit. Nothing can be done until the day the ban goes into effect. Your dates are very unrealistic at this point. The Supreme court has already ruled the EPA doesn't have the power to change laws made by congress that has a big monetary impact on the part of the economy the new rules would affect. But then again you are just really looking to make money on your YT account video content. Are you in Nepean ?
Denver has R-420-G
I was just starting to like 404a too Service area Orleans??
Isn’t the older stuff Better and last longer therefore creating less waste? Isn’t that the goal they are trying to achieve?? I know about the ozone but that’s a croc I don’t buy it.
I want my R-22 back. ❄️
I don't believe a word of this
Why not just switch to one and final refrigerant? I'm not in the HVAC business but heard ammonia or butane would work well. Service area Kanata??
Let's imagine the world was a 100 foot long river. The United States sits dead in the middle of this imagined river. With a slice of the river that is 12 inches wide and spans the width. Our little slice has multiple environmental restrictions and EPA regulations. No dumping of any kind allowed. Yet, in the rest of the river, all other countries dump whatever they want in the water in their little slice. Did our strict regulations solve anything??? Nope, it's all about the money.
The new Mexican drug of choice will become 401a.😱😂 Are you in Barrhaven ?
I still put in r12 r22 and 502. It's never gone
they phase it out as the patent runs out, Dupont controls the refrigerant market completely.
2050, 10k PSI, 10% employee death/injury rate. Like Jesus Christ, let's switch to air at this point.
R12 has been faced out for so many years and there's tons of it being sold on the markets eBay Amazon everywhere you look there's tons of it
What’s the replacement for 410a? R22 has mo99
Are we talking large systems or everything? Residential, Automotive, even this huge 3 year old trend of heat pump water heaters? Almost everything sold today just switched to 410a now there is already something new? I feel bad for anyone that just purchased new r410 anything to only now having to think well now I have to thinking about replacing whole..
So your local HVAC contractor will upcharge their 410a by 50% because of the loss of 10% of supply. Be ready y’all!
EPA Oh The Lies Of GREED CORP> GOV>
EPA doesn't know a damn thing in my opinion. I'm still maintaining R22 systems using R22 direct replacement refrigerants.
Good riddance 410 sucks anyway. If everything isn't absolutely perfect, the head pressure goes through the roof!
Once again,''The progressive woke left destroys everything they touch''. Everything..
They keep phasing out the old when they shouldn't. We should have options . Like phase out the EPA Are you in Ottawa ?
Good. It's about time.
Tdx20 r458a drop in for 22 Are you in Kanata ?
It's all about the money, I still have my original r22 system that came with my house 1998. And a spare r22 condenser factory charged in my garage, lol. I never liked 410a refrigerant, the r22 refrigerant cools better than the 410a in my opinion. I install, service, and repair HVAC-R for 20+ years, coolest trade in my eyes.
More refrigerant more problems more work more 💰
I havent even heard what the new freon is going to be. Im going out and buying 20 jugs of 410A and sitting on them till the price doubles
Whose patent is running out?
I was just in Cancun, Mexico in November. I saw 2 guys charging up an outdoor unit while we were in town. They had a brand spanking new R-22 cylinder still in the box with a 2022 date code. No big deal there I guess.
Reminds me of the ATF making up gun rules. EPA and ATF are not law making entities. Service area Nepean??
Once 410A is phased out I can't even begin to imagine how much a jug of R22 would cost. Thankfully I saved a new jug of R22 for my system… This environmental shit is getting out of hand, there are far larger impacts from other items tossed away in 3rd world countries. Service area Barrhaven??
Get rid of epa, they are evil
Home owner: I have no idea what my system currently uses 🙂 sigh..